Gemini consistently producing valid Pydantic responses

Hi,

I work with Gemini in a project that involves large-scale detection of bounding boxes. Given the size of the use case, I need structured output with minimal post-processing, so I rely on Pydantic models as the schema.

What I notice is that Gemini returns valid responses with a level of consistency that is unusual for LLMs. Even with fairly complex, conditional and nested schemas, the output always validates correctly for me. I would normally expect failures in structure or type when providing the schema via the prompt, but those do not seem to occur here.

From what I suspect, this reliability is not so much a result of training as it is a property of how tokens are selected during decoding. It looks as though the model is constrained in such a way that schema compliance becomes the default path.

Has anyone looked into this in more detail? I would be interested in pointers to documentation or prior discussion about how Gemini achieves this behaviour, and whether there are known edge cases where it breaks down.

Thanks in advance.

Regards,
Arian Ott

1 Like

Yes, I was curious about that.

@Arian-Ott ,

welcome to the community. Thanks for the feedback.

using “structured output” feature in gemini api will ensure that the responses adhere to the schema you need.

as a 2nd checkpoint having a pydantic schema in your application is a good practice given the non determinism of the llms in general.

you can also try to better your prompting by testing multiple runs and iterate the schema with a shot or few shot prompting.

@Akhilesh_Kambhampati,

thanks for the quick follow up.

Pydantic is definetely a good choice when structured responses are required. Also, pydantic is compatible with many LLMs which is quite handy if you have to change the model in the future.

Since I write a paper involving Bounding Box detection, I asked myself how Gemini handles the structured output so well. During the PoC i sent way over 1.000 images to Gemini and not a single time the response format was invalid.

From what i found in the internet is that OpenAI solves this by using Context Free Grammar to enforce JSON rules.

Maybe Gemini uses a similar approach :slight_smile:

https://openai.com/index/introducing-structured-outputs-in-the-api/

Cheers,
Arian